"Run as Administrator"

[ChrisGreaves]

Eileen's lounge is no different from a million other forums in that the posts are peppered with recommendations (that work ) that suggest:
Right-click, then Run As Administrator.

I am the only user, "ChrisP" of this system and AFAIK I set myself up as administrator when I re-installed a week ago.
I didn't used to have all these little pop-ups telling me that I have elected to change something every time I elect to change something.

Is it reasonable to want to change myself so that when I, Chris Greaves, Administrator, run a program, I don't have to allow myself to do what I want to do?

I am having a similar problem, I think, in a Word2003 application that's been running for 10 months under Win7, and years under WinXP before that, used to (Word 2003 VBA) FileCopy a bitmap image file to C:\Daily.BMP, and now balks at that.

I'm OK with increased security as the bad guys grow badder, but it seems to me that it ought to be possible to change the rules so that what I initiate is seen as allowable.

Or have I missed a basic truth, again?

(10 minutes later)
I should add that I appear as "Administrator" in CP.
(I assign myself a new identity at each installation; a long time ago I was ChrisG; next installation I'll be ChrisQ)

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[viking33]

I have disabled the UAC nag ( User Account Control ) right from the "get go," on both Vista and now Win 7.
Despite some dire warnings from some who say it is a security risk and that it will gradually fade away from it's frequent pest screens, I have managed to do without it very well, thank you.
Check here for a method to do it.
http://www.howtogeek.com/howto/windows- ... ows-vista/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[DaveA]

I am the only user, "ChrisP" of this system and AFAIK I set myself up as administrator when I re-installed a week ago.

Your account is a member of the "Admin Group" and is NOT "THE" Administrator.
The Administrator account that is built in is there for your protection and as time proceeds after a "Rebuild" it will pop up less and less. If you really think about it, when you first got this machine and was installing different programs you were clicking the OK, many times. Since you rebuilt it, you and the machine have to start over, UNLESS you turn OFF the UAC. But, once you turn it (UAC) back on, it MAY start over as in may not rememebr what you had been doing when the UAC was OFF.

[ChrisGreaves]

I am the only user, "ChrisP" of this system

Your account is a member of the "Admin Group" and is NOT "THE" Administrator.

Hi Dave, and Thank You for the explanation.
When the machine arrived (and I re-installed Win7 Home from recovery) back in Dec 2010 I don't recall all this "click to OK run" stuff; seriously, I may have done it and been so overwhelmed by everything else that was new that I forgot about it, but I doubt it.
I rather suspect that in last week's recovery/installation I "did something different".

Given my situation (sole user, secure apartment; little of value to others etc, TrueCrypted data partition ...) is there any really sound reason why I should not be able to run programs from the keyboard and set myself to be administrator?

Actually, I thought that that's what I had done.
I have the impression that there HAS to be a named user under Win7, and so volunteered as "ChrisP".
Take it as a given that I have at least one recommended malware suite on duty, and two others run manually at least once a week.

[ChrisGreaves]

Despite some dire warnings from some who say it is a security risk ...

Thanks Bob.
I confess to wanting to be rid of it, feeling that it is overkill.
I read the thread with great interest; arguments for and against.

I'm still :sittingonthefence:

[DaveA]

I understand that by turning OFF the UAC, then you will have "THE" powers of "The Administrator". BUT, if a hacker or program finds a crack in any way and can access your machine then the thacker or program will have FULL Administrator rights.

As you may know, if you have a BAT file and is run without running the Cmd as Administrator, then one will be asked permission to run said bat file and the keyboard MUST be used to type the OK, it can NOT be included in the bat file. With the UAC turned off, one should not be asked and the OK is NOT needed. So anything that you happen to snag onto on the internet that was to run something it will and your other protection may not catch it.

I can give you a few websites if you care to test your machine and may have to rebuild it again?

[ChrisGreaves]

I understand that by turning OFF the UAC, ...

I am moved to comment by my experience of the past few minutes.
There I am in the quiet of a Sunday morning, minding my own business, using FastStone to make screen videos, when the little UAC-thingy pops up and asks if it is OK if MyDefrag can come out to play.
It Is NOT!
What's MyDefrag doing? It has installed itself with a regular daily task at 5:00 a.m. to defragment something or other (thereby sending my drive to the MTBF point sooner than ever).
The MyDefrag help file sends me to Control Panel, Administrative Tasks, Scheduler, where I nip young MyDefrag in the bud and find a whole slew of pre-programmed tasks set up for things I care not about. Plus a gazillion MSoft tasks which I'm leaving alone.

So, Hooray for UAC.
Had it not been for UAC I would have just assumed that my system had it in for me and had decided to be slow and cranky this morning, without knowing that MyDefrag was chewing away at whatever spare computing capacity I had left.

(signed) "Starting to like UAC" of Toronto.

Thanks Dave!

[viking33]

Chris,
I told you so!

[ChrisGreaves]

I understand that by turning OFF the UAC, then you will have "THE" powers of "The Administrator".

Hi Dave.
I've been pondering this for a week.
I didn't used to have to acknowledge these prompts when first I got the system in Dec 2010, and after my install (Nov 2011) I have to acknowledge the prompts which pop up.
That leads me to the conclusion that the initial (factory) installation had me set up with "THE powers of The Administrator"; I'm sure I'd have noted the incessant interventions during my first month or two with Win7.
There's a possibility that a recent Win7 update instituted the policy, but given your remarks, I think not.

I know that I am often "too set in my ways", and am moving some files out of C:\ (I was copying my random wallpaper.bmp to the root, now copying them to C:\Greaves\) which gets around some self-created problems, but I rather suspect in the end I'll get rid of the UAC.
Many regular tasks which I execute persist in introducing an extra manual step into what is designed to be an automatic process.

I'd rather like to post an example of the most frequent/aggravating case if you'd oblige me by responding. It is quite possible that I've missed something here, some setting.

I just can't (yet) believe that Win7 is supposed to be so counter-productive in terms of automation.

Are other folks just blindly turning off UAC and shrugging off the risk? Am I the only one (whine-of-my-life!)? Is there something really weird about my hardware/software? Will Roland, speeding through the night rain, reach the railroad crossing in time? ...

[JoeP]

Have you looked at the settings for UAC on your PC? You can change the settings to "quiet it down" without completely turning if off.

Joe

[ChrisGreaves]

You can change the settings to "quiet it down" without completely turning if off.

Hi Joe, and thanks for the response.
Here is what I see at the moment (Control Panel, Action Centre, Change User Account Settings).
Should I set them "lower", e.g. one notch closer to "Never Notify"?

Untitled.png

[JoeP]

I'd leave it alone as the next notch down just says the same thing except it add "don't dim the screen". The setting in your pic is the setting I use on all the Win7 PCs I access. It is not troublesome to me. Pretty much the only time I see the UAC prompt is when I install programs or select "run as administrator" but otherwise I guess I have my data structured so that I use folders that don't cause the OS heartburn.

I'd leave UAC alone and just get used to a slightly different organizational method. If you pay attention to UAC when the prompts happen it is a good thing as an additional layer to keep you from accidentally infecting your system.

Joe

[viking33]

Sigh........both sides have presented their case, for and against UAC, Chris.
It's now up to you, the one man jury, to decide what to do for your own system.
For me, if there were a setting lower than "never notify," that's where mine would be set.

[StuartR]

Can I pile in now?

I have seen so many personal computers that have been completely taken over by bad stuff that I support anything that might make a difference. I think that UAC is one useful tool in a many-layered set of defences.

[ChrisGreaves]

It is not troublesome to me.

Joe, you make me jealous!
Here's a typical example for me. In this case I want to remove the clipboard-control/pane from MSWord. I have previously made a setting then saved it as *.reg, but the situation that arises is identical for many regular tasks I perform such as executing a defragmentation program (MyDefrag), or an uninstaller (RevoUninstaller).

It seems to me to be all very well for UAC to question some application or executable file, but there ought to be a way for me to say "I trust THIS file, there's no need to be paranoid about it"

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This is my little REG file. Agreed that I want to change the registry, but why not? MSoft itself recommends registry changes.
But again, it ought to be possible to store the signature of this file somewhere and trust it as long as the signature is faithful.

After double-clicking I get the familiar pop-up screen that inhibits all other computer activity, so not even a PrtScr command, let alone a quick Alt-tab to check on the file's folder ...

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The Registry Editor is NOT the ACB control, I know, but since I have no way to suppress this message, it becomes just another manual step in what should be an automated process.

004.png

Same comments apply here.

What I think used to be a single operation (double-click) has now become a 4-step operation.

I know you didn't write the ACB-thingy, but can you tell me that you don't jump through these hoops every time you run the same *.Reg or disk utility program?

It will drive me bonkers.

Again: I'm all for security and am a little over-paranoid about breaches, but the UAC is turning me into a robotic-clicker; what I don't want to be.

[ChrisGreaves]

Can I pile in now?

Stuart, you're always welcome.
I agree with you; I have grown tired of fielding complaints from users who use no protection then expect me to bail them out.

But please read my response to Joe (5 minutes ago) and tell me if you have to do the click-thing every time you run a utility.
Clicking through once to confirm an identity/signature is acceptable; it's the way NoScript works.
But having to jump through the hoops every time I run a program is what would drive me to disable UAC and take my chances.

I don't like that as an option because I like to keep my system squeaky-clean to re-assure my clients.

[HansV]

How often do you install or uninstall software or edit the registry. I have UAC set to Default, but I see the UAC prompt perhaps a handful of times a week, and I know when to expect it. If the UAC prompt would pop up unexpectedly, it'd make me extra alert.
If I saw the UAC prompt many times a day, it'd be different - apart from being annoying, it would lose its effectiveness because I might be tempted to allow it without thinking...

[ChrisGreaves]

How often do you install or uninstall software or edit the registry. I have UAC set to Default, but I see the UAC prompt perhaps a handful of times a week, and I know when to expect it. If the UAC prompt would pop up unexpectedly, it'd make me extra alert.

Hi Hans.
I see it many times a day, and starting first thing tomorrow morning I think I'll keep a log for, say, 72 hours; Wed/thu/Friday, typical business days for me.
I agree that an unexpected UAC prompt is useful, but like the boy who cried wolf, I am losing my faith in UAC.

If I saw the UAC prompt many times a day, it'd be different - apart from being annoying, it would lose its effectiveness because I might be tempted to allow it without thinking...

Exactly. Rather like "I Agree" on licensing terms.

Am I correct in thinking that UAC should remember what's OK, and what's not?
I can't imagine using a spam-detector that had to be told every time an eMail arrived from BeerGuy, SexyLady or FreeMoney ...

[StuartR]

...Am I correct in thinking that UAC should remember what's OK, and what's not?...

You are incorrect. UAC prompts each time.

I also only see the UAC prompt when I am doing system maintenance work. It never appears for routine work such as editing and printing documents, browsing the web and sending emails.

[JoeP]

Those registry editor prompts have nothing to do with UAC. They are just the way it works. I can't remember the last time I did not see those prompts. I also don't mess with the registry often.

When you run any program that is going to make system level changes you have to put up with UAC. As with what Hans said, I see UAC just a few times during the week. I know when to expect the UAC prompt. If I see it some other time I pay extra attention.

UAC does not remember prior responses and also does not let you build a "safe list". If it did what would happen if one of those programs was replaced by malware?

Joe