Oh-oh...it might just be back again...

[Rudi]

...just when some of us were getting along fine without it...
Windows Start Menu

[IMNetUser]

I have very mixed emotions on this isswueissue.

Microsoft would have been smart to include these features on Windows 8.X, then slowly transition away in future releases.

I do not think touch screen users will opt for the button, but non-touch screen users might.

I can see companies with touch screen not wanting the start button - depending on what they want the computer functions to do.

[HansV]

Microsoft is in a difficult position. Windows 8 hasn't been doing very well with professional/corporate users - its market share is growing even slower than that of Windows Vista 8 years ago, and Vista is generally seen as a dud (rightly or not, that's not the point here). If they want to win over those users, they must find a way to distinguish the next version of Windows from Windows 8(.1)...

[IMNetUser]

Hans - I think you hit the nail on the head.

Unfortunately, Microsoft is in a two steps forward, one step back.

As I mentioned earlier, I have mixed emotions on this issue. If I had a touch screen, the migration probably would not have been as severe for me.

I also was frustrated with people calling for help using the touch screen and I could not verify which icon they were touching or position of the icon on their screen.

The more I used 8.X, the more used to it I became and the more I like it. I think overall, Microsoft is going in the correct direction.

Part of my initial dislike was the non-support for XP.

I came from a meeting last night where the middle school will be required to "Upgrade" 70 machines from XP to Windows 8.X or 9.

[DaveA]

I do NOT like the use of a touch screen. Even on my Kindle, I have to keep cleaning it as the "Prints" just bother me. I keep a "Fiber Cloth" handy and keep the screen clean. Even using a "Stick" instead of my fingers, the screen gets messy.
When helping some on with a "Touch" screen, one needs to be VERY careful abut pointing to the different areas of the screen.

On my Windows 8 (Now 8.1) machine, I have been running Classic Shell and does things the way I want them. This laptop does NOT have a touch screen and I do not think I will ever buy one. I think it is smart of Microsoft to step back and remember where there prime customers are.

The wife pick up a LG tablet when she got her new phone. I have been playing with it and do not really like it, for the same reasons and others as it has to much Google influence to it.

[Rudi]

I must admit that I really do not mind the direction in which these technology giants push us mere mortals in. I adapt and make peace with whatever in in front of me. I do have my personal opinions and favourites and stick with these until I am forced to move through service, company code or need. Currently my choice is more hardware than soft. I prefer a laptop far above the tablets. Working in docs, and even in this forum is so much more convenient on my PC as I have all the programs and apps to interact here, testing out files and VBA, sizing, cropping and uploading images, and the convenience of multiple windows....it's just not the same on a tablet or iPad. As for my PC...I don't mind if it is running XP, Win7 or Win8, as long as I can do what I need to with convenience and ease.

[PJ_in_FL]

Touch screen devices substituting for traditional KMD I/O will increase the incidence of neck and wrist injuries as there is no way to position the screen to satisfy optimal ergonomic positioning of the arms/wrist/hand for touching the screen and the neck/eyes for viewing the screen. The optimal location spheres do not overlap.

The poor ergonomic implementation of this configuration was apparent to anyone who used the CADAM screens that used a light pen touching the screen for drafting. Holding the pen up to the screen contributed to considerable neck strain, and the monitor had to be too close to the eyes so the user could reach without stretching which would cause even more strain on the lower back!

By the way, putting a 24" CADAM screen in your lap was NOT advised (probably close to 100 pounds ) so the hands/wrist was always at a poor angle.

I'd like to see a tablet device that projected the image onto a flip-up screen, or better yet created a holographic image in front of the user, and the screen still used touch access with visual cues on the projected display -- like using a mouse with a desktop PC.

My personal preference is a setup with multiple computers with multiple screens, interfaced by a single keyboard/mouse for all, with a program like Mouse Without Borders or Synergy to connect it all together so I can multitask without overtaxing a single computer. Now if Microsoft will just create an OS that lets me drag and drop running programs between computers seamlessly ...

[BobH]

I must admit that I really do not mind the direction in which these technology giants push us mere mortals in. I adapt and make peace with whatever in in front of me. I do have my personal opinions and favourites and stick with these until I am forced to move through service, company code or need. Currently my choice is more hardware than soft. I prefer a laptop far above the tablets. Working in docs, and even in this forum is so much more convenient on my PC as I have all the programs and apps to interact here, testing out files and VBA, sizing, cropping and uploading images, and the convenience of multiple windows....it's just not the same on a tablet or iPad. As for my PC...I don't mind if it is running XP, Win7 or Win8, as long as I can do what I need to with convenience and ease.

"Resistance if futile."

[Rudi]

"Resistance if futile."

Well put!

[hlewton]

I don't have any Win 8.x machines but if I did I would want the Start Button. With me it is the teaching Old Dogs New Tricks thing. I really don't mind changes but to me it has to make sense and a computer without the Start Button makes no sense.

[JoeP]

Windows 8.1 has the Start Screen. Currently, it is two views of what should be considered a start menu. The default view is of icon you choose to have shown. The other view is the all applications view (which can be set as the default view). With the all programs view you have four options to order the icons. With Windows 8.1, the default start screen can be easily customized to fit most peoples needs. You can fit about 50 medium size icons on the screen of a 21" monitor with out having to scroll.

Note: Microsoft has said they will return a start menu to the desktop in a future update. In spite of what may have been published so far there has been no reliable information on what the start menu will look like.

Joe

[Rudi]

I've been using Win8.1 for a while now and it is surprising how one compensates for the missing Start menu. I have pinned all my common apps on the taskbar and also have a simple launch bar for useful, but not so common apps...just for quick access...even though I could use the WIN button and type the app name to get access to it. Even though I am used to the missing start menu and don't miss it, I will be great to have it back though....

[JoeP]

You could rearrange the start screen to have the forty or fifty programs you need to access using regular sized icons. Close to two hundred if you use small icons.

Joe

[StuartR]

Can you arrange the Start screen in a hierarchy to enable you to find the applications?

[HansV]

Nope. You can assign a category to Start screen icons, and group the Start screen by category, but that's it.

Microsoft has announced that folders will be coming to the Start screen in Windows Phone 8.1 Update, so perhaps a future update for the desktop version will get them too.

[StuartR]

I'm sticking to Windows 7 for now then. I think I'll treat Windows 8 the same way I did Vista.

[Rudi]

I'm in line for 9 since I hate 8. Till then, 7 is heaven.

[BobArch2]

I don't have any Win 8.x machines but if I did I would want the Start Button. With me it is the teaching Old Dogs New Tricks thing. I really don't mind changes but to me it has to make sense and a computer without the Start Button makes no sense.

About 6 weeks ago, I braved the installation of Windows 8 (the Pro version) and followed through with updating it to Windows 8.1. This was a complete fresh install including all my apps. At first, confusion reigned as I tried to understand the O/S switch from my Win 98, Win XP, Win Vista and Windows 7 days. However, after a few days, my Win 8.1 environment resembled my Windows 7 environment. Feeling very comfortable with past desktop views, I switched Win 8.1 Pro to the desktop app. Now each and every day when booting up, the system boots directly into an uncluttered desktop view as seen below.

Another thing I did was borrow from past experiences by setting up a folder on the desktop and renamed it "Desktop Tasks". Then as I installed various apps I made a decision to either place its shortcut icon on the taskbar (like Rudi does) or move it to the Desktop Tasks folder (another snapshot shown below). At the moment, I only have five icons on the desktop... very uncluttered. If I see the need to access an app that is not on the taskbar, systray or Desktop Tasks folder, then switching to the Win 8.1 screen with all the other apps is very easy.

Anyway, just my approach to digesting the Win 8.1 environment.

BobsWin81StartupB.gif

DesktopTasks.gif

[DaveA]

Quicker and better yet, is to install a third party program, there are several.

I use "Classic Shell" and it gives you the look and feel of Windows 7 when booted.

[BobArch2]

Quicker and better yet, is to install a third party program, there are several.

I use "Classic Shell" and it gives you the look and feel of Windows 7 when booted.

"Classic Shell" was on my list of apps to be installed along with the 65+ apps that I did install. After working with the desktop view as reported above for a few days I elected to not install Classic Shell. However, that decision is not set-in-stone. Perhaps I will give it a whirl (assuming it is easy to uninstall like other apps).